Mammoth comes out with a new record on October 24th called The End. Metal Covenant got to talk with Wolfgang Van Halen and the band’s live guitarist Jonathan Jourdan as they were doing some promotion in Europe.

It’s the third record now from Mammoth, and it’s 10 songs and almost 40 minutes of playing time. Was that something that was thought out in the beginning, to stay around 40 minutes of playing time?

Wolf: I think the first album was so long because it was nice to establish a presence and to be able to play an hour of a show without needing to do covers or something. But at this point, third album, I feel like attention spans aren’t that good enough these days, where I think a 40-minute album is kind of the perfect length. If you’re done listening to it and you like it a lot, you listen to it again and you don’t feel like you wasted time. Sometimes an album that’s, like, two hours long is just a slog to get through, no matter how good it is. But also, on the contract side, you only need to turn in a 10-song album, and if you turn in any more, it’s almost like a waste of turning in the songs, to a certain degree. (Laughs) So yeah, a bit of mix of all that.

In this day and age where almost everything has gone digital, why is it still important to release an album?

Wolf: Maybe I’m just nostalgic or anything, but it’s just an important part of the process. I still think albums are important. I still care about how an album is arranged, you know. On every album I’m very particular about how each song goes into the other, and I really put all the thought into it, even though nine times out of ten, somebody is going to get it and hit shuffle, which is a bit of a bummer. (Laughs) But I still care about that stuff. So it might just lie in nostalgia. But I think it’s nice to have strong feelings about the process and how it used to be, because I think, you know, it was good.

Every album I listen to, I start from the beginning, and I listen to the end. What’s it like for you to listen to an album?

Jon: I think the same thing, because, you know, it’s hard to sum yourself up as an artist on one song. When you listen to Mammoth I and II, you have songs like Resolve, and you have songs like Don’t Back Down, and it would be hard to sum the band up on one song. Like having that sequence and listening to it kind of like as a movie score, is so important because it’s like a ride.

Can you name something in particular that you were thinking about when you were starting to put together songs for this new album?

Wolf: I think it was just a matter of challenging myself again. With the first album I just wanted to show, you know, who I was as my own artist. And there was such a long time between recording I and II, that by the time I got to Mammoth II, I was so excited that I think the material ended up being a little heavier, you know. Like the song Right? has all that double kick stuff. I think I was just really excited to just go nuts a little bit. And with this album, I think what I was focusing on the most was, like, keeping it raw and simple while still maintaining that power and heaviness. You know, I think in songs like Better Off or Same Old Song, I didn’t try to go over the top with drums. I just tried to focus on the groove. There’s still fun moments with solos or, you know, like The End, how it starts with a 40-second tapping thing. But overall I was more focused on keeping it raw. Like if you listen to a lot of the tracks, you hear a lot of studio noise. You know, the first song, One Of A Kind, ends with, like, 20 seconds of just feedback. We just kind of let it go. The End, you know, I yell into the pickup, ”Take one”, before we start. If you listen throughout the album, you can hear it’s almost just kind of like you’re in the studio listening.

And do you see yourself as someone who is into smaller details on the album, or is the rock ’n’ roll vibe also important when you make an album?

Wolf: I think it’s a bit of both, you know. You obviously want it to be the vision that you’re setting out to make, but at the same time, it’s important to let the ideas breathe and become what they’re going to be instead of forcing them into something else. It’s a weird thing, songwriting. Like you think, you know, ”Oh, if I could write a good song, I’d do it every time.”, but you’re almost more of a vessel for the idea. So it’s like whatever the idea becomes is what it’s destined to be rather than you molding it into something you want it to be. ‘Cause sometimes your favorite ideas will just end up being, you know, like a B-side on the record. But then an idea that you came up with the last second ends up being the best song on the record. So it’s just whatever it becomes. You just keep dusting it off until it matures.

And a question for you, Jon, since you have a little bit different perspective than Wolf has. In your own opinion, how do you see this new album continue the path of the previous Mammoth music?

Jon: It’s kind of like a really cool fusion of the first two in the sense of there’s still heavy moments, but I feel like at the core of it, it’s just the fine-tuning songwriting, you know. And kind of like Wolf said, there’s this live element, there’s this rock element, but there’s no sacrifice of, like, song quality. And I think you can hear it with, like, The End. You know, we hear these songs as they’re slowly being developed, and kind of like Wolf just said too, about you have an idea of where something’s going, but where it ends up is, you know, kind of up to the song itself.

Wolf: It’s funny. I showed the band all the demos backstage in Mexico at the very last Metallica show we were opening for.

Jon: We’re already, like, on cloud nine, we’re, like, wrapping up two years with Metallica, and we sit down and listen to these demos, and it’s like, ”Oh, cool.”, and then your imagination starts going. And we all leave off tour, and Wolf gets back into the shed and works on the record, and every time we reconvene there’s these new developments. And to answer your question, album three, what I really like about it is the songwriting is even being kicked up a notch more, I think. And then the live elements are still there. It’s not like this overly polished record where everything’s digital. It’s, you know, a live sounding record, I think.

And when you play those songs live, is it hard to keep to the original guitar track, or is it very easy to go into something more Jon, if I would say so?

Jon: I think that with all of us, we try our hardest to keep it as close as possible to what’s happening on the record, because, you know, at the end of the day there’s all these moving parts and every part has a purpose in the song. It’s all really, you know, defined and well-written stuff. We’re not all playing the same thing on stage. So if we take too many liberties, it kind of unglues it, I think. So the challenge is, like, really sticking to the script. But also, we stretch parts out live, and we make a bridge twice as long, you know.

Wolf: It’s important that they still feel like themselves and they’re not just, like, trying to replicate the album perfectly. Ronnie, specifically, can be very, very anal about that with his pedal board and wanting it to be perfect, but I encourage them to be themselves while still, you know, ”At least play the song.”, but, like, ”I want you guys to be comfortable and not have to be such a stickler about you trying to play it exactly how it is.”.

Jon: Yeah, that’s one question I get a lot from friends and just people I come across. They say, ”How is it working with him? Is he a dick? Do you have like a straight line you have to walk?”, and I reflect on it, and I’m like, ”You know what? I never had that…

Wolf: I don’t think there’s ever been a time where I’ve been like, ”Play it like this.”. I don’t think I’ve ever done that.

Jon: That’s the answer. The more I think about it, it’s like, ”Wow. I’ve never…”. And then you start getting in your own head, and like, ”Am I getting too out of line?”.

Wolf: I’ll watch them play stuff. I don’t think I’ve ever stopped and told them what to do. Unless they have any specific questions on how I played it, I like to let them learn how to do it, and it’s really fun to see how they interpret it.

Jon: The one time I could say that, ”Okay. I need you to lay this out for me.”, was the first single, The End, because it’s got this, you know, proggy, like slap pop kind of thing going on. That was the one time I think probably since the beginning. I was like, ”Okay. I need you to break this down for me ’cause I don’t wanna get it wrong.”.

Wolf: Unless they’re hitting a wrong note, which they never do, you know, or if they’re asking for specifics, I like them to do what they want.

When you pick the songs to play live, are you the sole decision maker, Wolf?

Wolf: At the end of the day, sure. But I like to take into account what the guys feel like, ’cause there are definitely different songs than others where it’s like, ”Oh, this one’s fun to play.”. For example, we play the song Stone from the first album a lot, and if you look at streaming, like nobody listens to it. But we love it, so we play it anyway.

Jon: It’s a long one too, so if we put that in the set, you’re taking two songs out.

Wolf: That goes back to the attention span, you know. Just with streaming in general, you’ll see like by the seventh song on an album, it drops off. And so those last three songs are probably not gonna be as listened to as much, so I think it’s almost important to play it live so that people realize, ”Oh, this song’s pretty cool.”.

Rock albums usually have a ballad or two, but when I listen to this new album, I really can’t find any kind of ballad material. So what’s your take on ballads here?

Wolf: I mean, compared to the last album, Waiting was certainly more of a ballad, you know. Or, like, Distance. But then, you know, we also have the kind of upbeat, you know, poppy songs that are like Think It Over from the first album or Miles Above Me from the second. But I think on this third one, the closest would be All In Good Time, the closer. I thought it was kind of necessary because I guess the lyrical content in my headspace for everything… You know, it was a bit darker lyrically. And I think it was important to kind of have a light at the end of the tunnel where that one is more of a hopeful track. Closest thing to a ballad you got on the record.

Yeah, closest thing, because it’s only parts of that song which I would consider a ballad.

Wolf: It gets loud and there’s a big drum solo at the end. But, you know, that’s the closest thing to a ballad you’re gonna get, which I guess shows you that this really is just kind of a raw rock album.

Jon: I think that kind of leans into the sequencing thing too. That’s why it’s so important listening to a record still top to bottom, or at least caring enough for that 10 percent that listens to the record top to bottom.

Wolf: Yeah, if you care about that, or you care about the listening process of, like, putting the vinyl on, you’ll get that experience with Mammoth. We always make sure of that.

And you’re using the same producer once again. So what’s making your collaborations so special so that you work with the same guy over and over again?

Wolf: I think he’s a really important person and a really important part of the process. I think when people see that I’m playing everything and I write everything, they must think like, ”Oh, he’s a controlling maniac who doesn’t take anybody else’s ideas into perspective.”. Elvis (Michael Baskette) is that guy. He really is the person I collaborate with during this. He helps me stop myself from doubting myself or lets me know if I’m going down the right path. And so he’s a very important part of that creative process for me in how I realize ideas. And so I just can’t imagine not having him there. And plus, he’s just a wonderful person. He’s a great musician. He, his engineer Jef (Moll), and his assistant Josh (Saldate), the four of us, is what it takes. You put us in the studio, we’ll just have a good time, and all of a sudden, two months later, you have an album we’re all very proud of.

Of course, a producer might be important, especially when you’re on your own…

Wolf: Sure. But I don’t think people realize to the level that Elvis is a collaborative partner in Mammoth in the songwriting process.

So hypothetically, if you would use a different producer than him, would the result be really different?

Wolf: It would probably be much different. It would probably end up being something I wouldn’t be as happy with. You know, if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it. I’ve been very proud and happy of these last two and now this third one. You know, why mix it up? ’Cause at the end of the day, it might be a selfish thing to say as an artist, I do this for me. I do this because I wanna make the music I wanna hear. And if somebody doesn’t like that, that’s totally cool. I’m happy with what I did here, and at the end of the day, that’s all that really matters.

A lot of rock bands, and heavy metal bands, and hard rock bands, or whatever, nowadays, when studio time costs a lot of money, prefer recording stuff in their bedroom. Is that something you do as well outside of the studio time?

Wolf: I think I’m a special case. I feel an obligation to record in 5150, you know, of being the only one there now. I have an obligation to make sure I fill the walls with music at least once a year, or at least every 18 months, so to speak. But yeah, when I have the opportunity, I’ll certainly make stuff on my laptop. But I think this time around, the pre-pro process was a bit different compared to the last two albums, because I would usually do something on Logic on my computer, but it’s always a bit time-consuming so I think that almost gets in the way of the creativity at a certain point for me. The last two albums, the studio always needed some sprucing up. You know, some stuff wouldn’t work, we’d need this, we’d need that, and we’d need to spend a couple of weeks to get it ready to go. We were early on that this time around, so by the time we got to the pre-pro section, everything was ready to go. So this time around, I would sit in the control room, pick a tempo, and record a minute of guitar, run out, play drums to it, come back. And I was able to do it really quickly, and I think that really informed a lot of the creative decisions on this record. I don’t think songs like One Of A Kind, The End, or even I Really Wanna would exist in the way that they did, had this pre-pro situation not been what it was, because I wouldn’t have taken as many chances, say with the big tempo change that happens at One Of A Kind, or the fact that The End opens with 40 seconds of tapping, or that I Really Wanna is a really low Drop A riff. I think I wouldn’t have taken as many chances, like, ”Well, let’s see if this works.”, ’cause it would only be a minute if it didn’t. Whereas if I spent, you know, three hours on a Logic demo, it would have felt like a waste of time, or I wouldn’t have reached that conclusion that I did.

You said that you were running back and forth between the instruments. That would be a very tough thing to do at home because the drums need to be recorded in a studio.

Wolf: That was the big thing for me, because programming the drums on Logic is a time-consuming thing for me ’cause I’m very specific about it. I don’t want, like, the fucking AI drummer taking over, and I need it to be really specific, and so being able to do that certainly eased the time aspect of that, so it was a bit more creatively flourishing.

Let’s go to the front cover. It’s like a lot of yellow, and a little bit red, and it’s kind of clean. So tell me about the idea of the front cover.

Wolf: First of all, it’s a wonderful artist. He goes by the name Moon Patrol on Instagram. Very, very talented. This is, you know, an evolution of Mammoth. It’s the first titled album. You know, it’s not Mammoth III; it’s The End. Especially my headspace during creation of the album was very panicked and very anxiety-ridden, and so I think it’s just a good representation of sort of that trap of being in your head, and everything, feeling like it’s over. But I do think that The End can mean many different things. You know, when you’re in any type of scary situation, it feels like everything’s over. But it can be the end of bad things too. You know, it can mean a lot of different things. That’s why I think ending with All In Good Time on a positive note is almost the positive take on that idea, whereas most of the record, the other nine songs, are kind of focused on the negative of what the end can mean, for sure. (Laughs)

When I first saw the album title, I was like, ”Okay. That’s what bands do when they’re finishing their career.”, and also like, ”That seems kind of dystopian.”.

Jon: The rest of the band guys, we were like, ”Wolf?”. (Laughs)

Wolf: You know, it’s the thematic idea of that. It doesn’t hurt to have people see that, and have all these types of thoughts, you know. It gets people thinking, where overall it’s certainly like, ”It’s only our third album. I’m not stopping.”. This is what I do, you know.

So the other nine songs. What kind of lyrics are you presenting on this album?

Wolf: I was more open to painting more of a picture with certain songs rather than just trying to therapeutically say fuck you to every bad thought in my head. Songs like One Of A Kind, or say Happy, I think paint a picture and tell more of a story that’s sort of outside a personal experience. And it was fun to have, you know, the music itself thematically tie in, ’cause I think, you know, if you pay attention to the lyrics of One Of A Kind, it sort of tells this story that has a bad ending, and I think it’s really fun that it’s a very dissonant chord that the song ends on that almost thematically ties it into the lyrics. So little things like that.

Is it difficult to not open up too much about your private life when going into lyrics writing?

Wolf: I don’t think you can think about it. I guess it’s a tricky way of writing because creatively I can be writing my own meaning to every song that is as close to me personally as it can be, but what I love about lyrics is that anybody can take their own interpretation of it. It can mean something completely different. So I don’t really ever think about trying to hide myself away, ’cause it’s a therapeutic process for me. You know, like I said earlier, it’s just a matter of finding out what the song is about while you’re writing it, and then it kind of happens.

In the end of the The End video you’re showing your actor skills. What’s it like to see yourself act?

Wolf: I took theater in high school, so it’s not too unfamiliar for me. It’s fun. I think it’s another muscle to work on. Being able to have Robert Rodriguez directing you is a pretty cool thing. And he was actually the one standing in for me when I punched myself. He was right there. And the way he edited it was just so crazy. It really looks like I hit the shit out of myself. It’s awesome. Just being able to work with him was a dream. Yeah, it was crazy.

And most people who aren’t musicians or actors would be kind of embarrassed to see themselves in an acting scene. Is that something you think about before going into a scene like that?

Wolf: I hate seeing myself do anything. Doing it is the fun part, I think. I don’t think I’ve watched the video since we released it. You know, I’m proud of what we did, but I guess I’m just more of a rather-work-behind-the-scenes type of guy.

You guys are offering a VIP experience on tour. Tell me about that thing from a band’s perspective.

Jon: It’s cool to kind of meet the people that are supporting you. The people that are putting their time and energy and money, and coming out and seeing the act. You know, they are the ones that you’re here for. We come over here to meet these people, and to put the show on, but it’s definitely a cool experience. We did a VIP on, I think, the last headliner, and it was always unique with just all the different faces. Some familiar, some new. You know, the questions that you get. It’s a bit of, like, “All right, we can relax.”, and it’s not, you know, too formal.

Wolf: Yeah, it’s fun to let people into the less formal aspects of touring and everything, and just to kind of be in a less high-pressure situation like the show, you know.

And what’s different between a VIP experience, where the fans definitely are really hardcore fans, and doing, like, a regular meet and greet or a signing session?

Wolf: Well, I guess maybe just the specifics. You know, with a meet and greet for us, if we’re at a festival or something, it’s kind of shaking hands and taking pictures, whereas with our VIP, they get to see us play stuff, they get to request a song or two, and then we do the Q&A, and we do a big picture. You know, it’s fun. Yeah, it’s really just the specifics of it all.

Besides Mammoth and other music, what else is there in life for you guys?

Wolf: It’s tough, man. I mean, since we’ve started being a touring entity, as of July of ‘21, really Mammoth is all we’ve been doing for the most part. Any time off I have, I like to just be at home with my wife, and watch shitty TV shows, and play video games, because any time I get outside of Mammoth I just try to make it as relaxing as possible.

Jon: I think that’s a big thing. It’s just time to relax. You know, be creative in your relaxed home environment. Or just not be creative is sometimes a nice thing. You know, not to do music. It’s just to relax, video games, movies, loved ones.

Wolf: Just to force yourself to relax in between, ‘cause while we love what we do, it’s still work, and you need to be there mentally, and so you need to afford that mental fortitude by relaxing as much as you can.

You (Wolf) were obviously born into a rock ‘n’ roll life, as you were having a famous father in rock music. Maybe you (Jon) were born into a rock ‘n’ roll life as well, but not having the same family behind you. What would you (Jon) say is the biggest difference coming into the big scene later than Wolf did?

Jon: Initially, I think there’s a bit of, “You’re just a little fish in a big pond.”. But then you realize how small the industry is. We have a saying, “Be on time. Don’t be a dick.”.

Wolf: You’d be surprised how many people don’t follow those two rules. (Laughs)

Jon: Right. Yeah, man. It’s a 50-50. On any of these amazing tours we’ve been a part of, the majority of the people that have been around for a long time also adhere to that, regardless of where they’re at in their career. I remember the first time, kind of starting this process with Wolf, and part of my brain was like, “I wonder what he’s gonna be like? How is this gonna go?”, and then hanging out, and it’s just like, “Oh, we’re all the same type of individuals.”. At the end of the day, we’re all just musicians, we’re all just songwriters. We wanna be entertainers, you know.

Wolf: We’re all just people. We’re just dudes.

Jon: And now, especially after doing it for so many years, there’s like a brotherhood to it. We’re going out doing the circuit with the bros, and we’re excited to get into the album three cycle, you know. This whole thing is gonna be just a lot of fun. We were talking about it a while ago, how it’s gonna be like the next tier as far as production level and just song choice. Now you have three records to pull from, you know.

Wolf: Well, it’s crazy, you know. We’re very thankful to do what we do. You know, we’ve been doing this for a while, and some of the places we’re playing are a little bigger. You know, there’s more people coming, which just means we’re connecting with more people. We’re very thankful, and very excited to give back, and to give them the show they deserve now that more people are starting to come. It’s crazy. And it just makes you that much more desperate to reach that next level of just being better.

By Tobbe – Published October 23rd, 2025